Caesar the Bronze-Winged Pionus

zazanomore wrote:

I wouldn't blame yourself for it. It's anxiety based. And anxiety doesn't just go away. It is going to be a long process. But I have all the hope in the world that you will help her on her journey to recovery. You are doing a fantastic thing

Thanks hon. I don't blame myself, not at all. I just feel bad for her I know it hurts when they pull feathers - Bucky used to YELL every time he pulled one out.

GlassOnion wrote:

When I meant foraging, I meant it as in 'foraging for parts of meals', which means that Caesar would not be 100% free-fed as she's working for her food.

Sigh, I'm a chronic nail biter.. it's sure HARD to fix. Good luck Vicki..

You make a good point GO. Foraging for meals makes a lot of sense, but since I can't get her to work for things she really really likes, and she's a picky eater anyway, should I take the risk of making her work that much harder for the food it takes to keep her alive? That's an honest question that I don't know the answer to. I'd really like feedback because I just don't know how to go about "fixing" her. (Fixing = Like THAT's going to happen! I can't even fix my chapped lips!)

ScooterNScotty wrote:

I don't even know if we know what causes it, let alone how to fix it. It's an even tougher nut than cribbing in horses. You could try a sock sweater.

I don't think we're at the point where she needs a sweater yet. This is the first time I've seen her pluck since I brought her home on the 8th of November - three weeks ago. It just so happens that the first time she plucked she went hog-wild-crazy.

coral wrote:

My pionus wont play with toys bigger then him either lol try small foot toys i can message you some links of toys marty really enjoys! as for the foraging idea i think that would help but marty wont forage either so an idea is that i stick nuts snuggly in an apple with the core taken out and some of the skin off so he has to get them out he doesnt like apple but this helps mikko! i know having a rescue that plucks is hard im going through the same thing with mikko! i think you guys are doing great with her though if you want some toy links let me know!

Coral, yes please! Toy ideas and links would be lovely! I'm a pionus novice, so any help would be MOST appreciated!

Margaret wrote:

I'm so lost here. I have to take a break from my live and read all topics!
You guys get that birds so fast, that I'm not able to follow

Of course congrats and good luck!

Margaret, Caesar is a Bronze Wing Pionus that I'm providing a foster home for while she gains some confidence and tries to grow some feathers. She's really fallen for my husband and doesn't really care much for me at all, but I'm kinda starting to like her. That's it in a nutshell.

Short answer on the foraging - if she doesn't/won't forage, yes, she can starve herself to death. As bizarre as that sounds.

Have you tried tying little paper ketchup cups all over the cage and put little bits of food in them for her to range around the cage to eat?

Have you tried additional/daily bathing? Sometimes that helps.

patdbunny wrote:

Short answer on the foraging - if she doesn't/won't forage, yes, she can starve herself to death. As bizarre as that sounds.

It doesn't sound bizarre at all, that's why I wasn't pushing it - and was a little worried about it.

patdbunny wrote:

Have you tried tying little paper ketchup cups all over the cage and put little bits of food in them for her to range around the cage to eat?

No. Didn't even think about that one. (Putting paper ketchup cups on my list... where can you buy those things anyway?)

patdbunny wrote:

Have you tried additional/daily bathing? Sometimes that helps.

Yep. Every day it's warm enough - she either bathes voluntarily, or involuntarily.

VickiNumbers wrote:

patdbunny wrote:

Have you tried tying little paper ketchup cups all over the cage and put little bits of food in them for her to range around the cage to eat?

No. Didn't even think about that one. (Putting paper ketchup cups on my list... where can you buy those things anyway?)

I klepto them from Wendy's or other fast food joint.

^Ummmmmm... I'm tellllliiiinnnnnn......

have you ever thought about trying a poncho for her? there is a cockatoo on another forum and her mom makes her all sorts of ponchos and it keeps her from plucking everything but her legs and i will send you all sorts of links lol!

I don't think she needs anything like that since like I said, she's only plucked once since she came home, and that was in response to a stressor. I think I may be getting her figured out... We'll see.

But, the BIG news is that I think we've decided to keep her. She's really grown on me, and it's no surprise that she's grown on my hubs. She brings a different energy to our house, and it's a nice one. Her personality has completely changed since the day she arrived. When she got here she was completely silent. Now she's hardly EVER silent! She's always "talking" when we're downstairs and making some kind of pionus noise. She does this back and forth shuffle where she's bent over some with her head down and her wings out a bit when she wants off of her cage to go be with Cal, and Cal asks her if she's dancing, calls it the "Pionus Shuffle." (Creative, huh?) It almost looks kind-of "sexy," if you know what I mean, but when she steps up and sits on his shoulder, she sits there so nice and quiet, I've decided that she's just trying to get up the nerve to fly.

Speaking of flying, she's clearly had some bad clips in the past which have resulted in some very bad experiences with flight. She's scared to death of it. When her primaries molt back in, she's going to be a very surprised bird. I'll probably need to keep her clipped to some degree for a while, mainly for her safety, but we'll see. Either way, I certainly want her to be able to fly better than she does now. I hate that I have a bird who's afraid to fly.

But the bottom line is that I'm pretty sure she's found her forever home. She has a Daddy, a Mommy, an annoying little Green Cheek Sister, a choir of budgies, and a heating pad to sleep beside on cold nights. How much better could one bird have it?

But, the BIG news is that I think we've decided to keep her.

that is great news, it's a win win situation for all three of you...when my birds semi squat with wings out, it usually means they want something, and most often as not they want to be picked up

i am so happy for you

dusty

VickiNumbers wrote:

the BIG news is that I think we've decided to keep her. She's really grown on me, and it's no surprise that she's grown on my hubs. She brings a different energy to our house, and it's a nice one. Her personality has completely changed since the day she arrived.

I suspected this would be coming! Good for you on deciding to keep her!

i knew you would keep her!!!! how could someone not fall in love with the pionus noises and the sweet eyes! they're just all around great birds! the pionus shuffle is kind of a mating thing, or at least thats what ive noticed with marty. he only does it for the dogs then he goes up to them bobs his and try to get on top of them to mate usually the dogs look at me and are like help me! i have a video of it its pretty funny. i think marty thinks hes a dog! for the plucking you can try feather in and aloe vera spray both found on my safe bird store.com helps feathers grow in and the aloe vera spray helps her not be itchy with the new growing feathers! have you looked at all the toy links i sent you lol? did you find any that ceasar might like?

Ceasar reigns! Yay! Will you be throwing a toga party?

dusty wrote:

when my birds semi squat with wings out, it usually means they want something, and most often as not they want to be picked up

coral wrote:

... the pionus shuffle is kind of a mating thing, or at least thats what ive noticed with marty. he only does it for the dogs then he goes up to them bobs his and try to get on top of them to mate...
...for the plucking you can try feather in and aloe vera spray both found on my safe bird store.com helps feathers grow in and the aloe vera spray helps her not be itchy with the new growing feathers! have you looked at all the toy links i sent you lol? did you find any that ceasar might like?

At first I thought I thought the Pionus Shuffle was a mating thing as well (that's what I was alluding to when I said it looked kind-of "sexy") but now, having watched her for a while and having seen what follows, I tend to believe it's more what Dusty suggests - that she wants to be picked up. As for the plucking, I intend to try the feather-in as soon as I can. I've already bought Aloe Juice and am spraying it on her daily except when it's too cold, like today. When it's too cold outside, we have a hard time keeping our house warm enough to let the birds bathe. We'll have a high of 10 today and even with the thermostat set low, the heater is running ALL the time. (Our house is SO energy inefficient!) Finally, I haven't had a chance to visit ALL of the links you've sent, but I'm making my way through them. You should find a place to post them on here, I can't think of where off hand (maybe in the Species section?), but they're a great resource.

ScooterNScotty wrote:

Ceasar reigns! Yay! Will you be throwing a toga party?

I know! Right?!! And a toga party? Only if every one of you promises to be there!

toga party...yessssssssssssss...lol

dusty

Caesar has started talking. I mean, she's been saying things she brought from her old family, but now she's talking like my husband. What am I going to do now? LOL!

She's been mimicking his laugh for quite a while, which I must admit is pretty funny - and he LOVES it. But today we caught her practicing something he's said. It's clearly his voice and we're not sure what it is that she's saying yet, but I for one can't WAIT to find out!

On a different note, Caesar has started being less than nice to my Allie-gator. (I love that nick-name!) It's probably less that she dislikes Allie, but rather that she's being territorial of the common areas - which is not acceptable. It's making me re-think the whole idea of keeping her - but then I doubt myself for rethinking. It's all rather aggravating, but that's just me. I hate it when I dont have all the answers and everything isn't going exactly the way I want it to. Has anyone else ever felt that way? LOL!

Well, that's the small Caesar update. Other than that, there's not much change. I think I've figured out that she seems to pluck on Mondays when Cal has been home over the weekend then goes back to work on Monday. I'm not looking forward to when he goes back after the Christmas holiday.

She really is bonding to your husband.

Have you considered keeping them separate? Like different areas?

zazanomore wrote:

She really is bonding to your husband.

Have you considered keeping them separate? Like different areas?

I don't know where we'd put them if we did that. We keep them in the main living area so they're a true part of our family. With our pets, that's really important to me (as it is with all of us). About the only thing I could do would be to separate their cages so they couldn't share cage tops, but that would leave Caesar without a play top to hang-out on during the day, and since she's the one who really prefers to hang out around the cages rather than move around the house like Allie does (Allie goes back and forth between me and her cage at will), it doesn't seem fair to leave Caesar without someplace nice to hang out. I DO have the necessary pieces to build a play-stand for them, so the possibility exists that I could build that and put it close to Caesar's cage for her, but I hate the fact that she could get all possessive of it and then Allie wouldn't get to play on it. *sigh* Life's quandaries, what do we do?

I'd give it some time. Often it takes a while for the dynamics to settle in a bit.

zazanomore wrote:

She really is bonding to your husband.

Have you considered keeping them separate? Like different areas?

Husbands don't tend to take well to being isolated. Lol!

Because of the size differential, scooter and Scotty dont have areas that are communal and, in fact, ive kept some areas accessible to one or the other. Don't know if tis is good policy or not, but bird-bird relations are the leat issue around here.

ScooterNScotty wrote:

Husbands don't tend to take well to being isolated. Lol!

Because of the size differential, scooter and Scotty dont have areas that are communal and, in fact, ive kept some areas accessible to one or the other. Don't know if tis is good policy or not, but bird-bird relations are the leat issue around here.

That was a good one!
Also, the size differential point is a good one. It's just frustrating that they *were* getting along fine, and now they're not. Maybe I should separate them.

can i have an update on allie and caesar?

Allie and Caesar seemed to have worked past their rough patch. Caesar isn't a bird's bird and probably never will be. Allie seems to want to have a bird to cuddle up to and preen on occasion, but when she cuddles up to Caesar, she moves away. It's funny for us to watch because we see Allie chasing Caesar and Caesar running from Allie, but we intervene before too long because it's obviously causing Caesar stress.

We HAVE seen Caesar bending down for Allie to preen her head and neck though, and wonder of wonders, we've seen Caesar returning the favor - so life isn't all bad for Caesar.

Caesar hates getting baths - she only likes taking them on her terms even though she needs to be taking more. She's finally starting to grow in some of her feathers - again. I'm hoping that this time she wont pull them out again. We think we've figured out that as long as her cage is opened early in the morning so she doesn't feel trapped, she doesn't pull. Never mind the fact that she's got a nice large cage that she hardly moves in, that doesn't seem to be the point. She just wants to be able to get out apparently.

She LOVES my hubs. (Shaking my head.) I'm waiting on her to start laying eggs for him. She wants to be with him whenever he's home. She starts calling for him the minute he comes through the door after work. If he doesn't come and get her when she calls for him, she'll go inside her cage and pout. It's really quite funny. My hubs doesn't know quite what to think about it all!

That's about it really. Aside from that it's just same-old same-old. She's having to get used to the fact that I'm still the bird-boss in the house despite the fact that I'm not her "love." When I've done something she didn't like, she's bitten me pretty good a couple of times. It didn't have to be something mean either - it could have been as simple as asking her to step up while she was on his shoulder. Regardless though, birds do what I want, not the other way around. Despite that, or maybe even because of it, neither of us has the heart to send her away at this point so she seems to be here for the long-haul.

i think cesear will warm up to allie if i try putting my birds near eachother they both run in oppisite directions seems like things are going really great there and im glad your gonna keep caesar! my pionus is a one person bird to though (thank goodness im that person lol) im glad that feathers are growing in for her

You never know, I have all fids together now: day and night. It takes some time, but you never know what they are about to be to each other

Merlin and Arthur go to war whenever they get near each other! I wish they would get along (of course I wish I could get along with Arthur too!)